Silver Umbrella, ST-E2 and 580exII

[pcho]

This is my first attempt using a silver umbrella with the 580exII. The flash was tiggered by the ST-E2. Unfortunately my kids told me off so I can only demonstrate this with my dog:biglaugh:

However this is the best result I have ever experience with the dog when using a flash. Any advice with using an umbrella would be very much appreciated. Should I use 2 umbrella etc and so forth. I have a white and clear (for shooting through it) umbrella as well.

Perry

Here is my sample picture

http://www.thepatienteye.com/albums/webforum/umbrella006.jpg

[j_b_l]

Perry, great results!

[Rudi]

Any advice with using an umbrella would be very much appreciated.

Perry,

Take the umbrella and fold it up. Then turn around and stick it... on the floor. :D Take one Gary Fong Lightsphere, place over 580EXII, place flash in hotshoe, and fire away (don't forget to turn on the flash as well as camera). See what results you get. :)

P.S. Say hi to Bella for me! :D

[pcho]

Perry,

Take the umbrella and fold it up. Then turn around and stick it... on the floor. :D Take one Gary Fong Lightsphere, place over 580EXII, place flash in hotshoe, and fire away (don't forget to turn on the flash as well as camera). See what results you get. :)

P.S. Say hi to Bella for me! :D

Yes Rudi, I have already tried it and it is not as good, not bad though

....and Bella said BOW WOW to you

Perry

[chezem]

Nice dog Perry. Which umbrella did you use? The white or the clear? :cheer:

[pcho]

Nice dog Perry. Which umbrella did you use? The white or the clear? :cheer:

Thanks Cheryl, I used the silver umbrella :)

Perry

[chezem]

Sorry Perry. It did say silver in your post. Have you tried the white one in the same situation? Where did you place the umbrella?

[EV Wonder]

All I've ever used an umbrella for is the rain, Perry, so I'm no expert, but I like it. In fact I think you did a very good job of Bella!!:)

[pcho]

Sorry Perry. It did say silver in your post. Have you tried the white one in the same situation? Where did you place the umbrella?

Hi Cheryl,

I have tried the white one, it gives a softer light and works well too. My next attempt is to mix the umbrella with Gary Fongs Lightsphere and see what results I get.

Perry

[Charlemagne]

Nice shot Perry, watch your backgrounds though, trying hanging an old white sheet up behind the dog and see what you get.

Charles

[Kevin]

I'm with Charles....get something that's plain. It will help remove any distractions, even if just for getting input on the light. ;)

Silver should work well with animals because the fur will absorb more of the light. Usually I don't like to use silver because it creates specular highlights on oily skin. Primarily I use white shoot-thru.

Adding the lightsphere to the umbrella will diffuse it further but also reduce the output, I'd suspect. I'm not a big fan of those anyway so I'm a bit jaded. I just think you need a larger lightsource for portraits, but that's just me.

If you were to add a secondary light, I'd suggest having it aiming down on the pooch to act as a hair light, providing additional separation from the background (which you're going to change on the next posting, right? ;))

[pcho]

Nice shot Perry, watch your backgrounds though, trying hanging an old white sheet up behind the dog and see what you get.

Charles

Thanks Charles, I was only mucking around as I have not started venturing into backdrops etc, more money again :)

I'm with Charles....get something that's plain. It will help remove any distractions, even if just for getting input on the light. ;)

Silver should work well with animals because the fur will absorb more of the light. Usually I don't like to use silver because it creates specular highlights on oily skin. Primarily I use white shoot-thru.

Adding the lightsphere to the umbrella will diffuse it further but also reduce the output, I'd suspect. I'm not a big fan of those anyway so I'm a bit jaded. I just think you need a larger lightsource for portraits, but that's just me.

If you were to add a secondary light, I'd suggest having it aiming down on the pooch to act as a hair light, providing additional separation from the background (which you're going to change on the next posting, right? ;))

Thanks Kevin,

I have 3 580's so I was going to play around with multiple flashes. So I wondered if that would work with 2 umbrellas and and third one with gary fongs lightshpere. I was told it is not advisable to use 2 umbrellas. Any input would be very much appreciated as i am just playing around at the moment.

Well if it does not work properly I will just go an purchase the the proper gear :)

Perry

[Kevin]

It would be best to use a human model when playing around with multiple flashes at least so you can see the where the shadows are falling.

Not sure why you were told not to use 2 umbrellas. One light in each umbrella or 2lights in 1? I used multiple umbrellas when I shot Nikon using their flashes and never had a problem and always got good results.

Still not crazy about the fong thing. Maybe for a background or hairlight but then it would spread like crazy. Maybe as a fill but I'd probably dial it down some addt'l so as not to create too harsh of a light. Fill is only to soften the shadows. You main light illuminates the subject.

[pcho]

It would be best to use a human model when playing around with multiple flashes at least so you can see the where the shadows are falling.

Not sure why you were told not to use 2 umbrellas. One light in each umbrella or 2lights in 1? I used multiple umbrellas when I shot Nikon using their flashes and never had a problem and always got good results.

Still not crazy about the fong thing. Maybe for a background or hairlight but then it would spread like crazy. Maybe as a fill but I'd probably dial it down some addt'l so as not to create too harsh of a light. Fill is only to soften the shadows. You main light illuminates the subject.

Thanks Kevin,

One more thing, do I shoot in ettl mode or manual

Perry

[Kevin]

I don't know enough about Canon's system but if ettl means the camera's doing the thinking, I'd say shoot manual. If you have a flash meter take a reading and set your ratios on the individual lights.

Even for as sophisticated as Nikon's CLS system is, I manually set ratios on the individual flashes based on what I was trying to accomplish and the distance from the light source to subject.

[Rudi]

Simplest way to do this with Canon's flashes, Perry, is to use the ST-E2 (which you have). Then dial in the desired ratio in the ST-E2 and control your light output by dialing in flash compensation to your liking.

Also, I have no idea why you were told that using two umbrellas is a bad idea... rolleyes;

[Jeff JTPhoto]

Perry I prefer a simple 3 flash set up. Main flash bounced off white umbrella at 45 degrees and little higher then subject. Second flash just above or beside the camera for fill set to 3:1 ratio or 1 2/3 stops less light then the main and the third flash behind the subject pointing to the background either +1 0r -2 stop difference from Main depending on background color and the effect I'm after. As Rudi has already mentioned the ST-E2 or one of the 580ex's can control the output ratios in ETTL2 for all the flashes.

[pcho]

Perry I prefer a simple 3 flash set up. Main flash bounced off white umbrella at 45 degrees and little higher then subject. Second flash just above or beside the camera for fill set to 3:1 ratio or 1 2/3 stops less light then the main and the third flash behind the subject pointing to the background either +1 0r -2 stop difference from Main depending on background color and the effect I'm after. As Rudi has already mentioned the ST-E2 or one of the 580ex's can control the output ratios in ETTL2 for all the flashes.

Thanks Jeff,

Does that mean that I only use 1 umbrella.

1. White Umbrella at 45 degrees and little higher then subject

2. Second flash without umbrella just above or beside the camera for fill set to 3:1 ratio or 1 2/3 stops less light than the main

3. Third flash behind the subject pointing to the background either +1 or -2 stop difference from Main

I will certainly try this.

Perry

[Jeff JTPhoto]

Thanks Jeff,

Does that mean that I only use 1 umbrella.

1. White Umbrella at 45 degrees and little higher then subject

2. Second flash without umbrella just above or beside the camera for fill set to 3:1 ratio or 1 2/3 stops less light than the main

3. Third flash behind the subject pointing to the background either +1 or -2 stop difference from Main

I will certainly try this.

Perry

That's correct. Just one Umbrella Perry. The fill is giving off less light so it doesn't require an umbrella.

[Kevin]

Just a word of caution. You don't want your fill to cause any shadows of its own. Its purpose is simply to lighten up the shadows created by the main light. Without it being diffused as a larger source, it may become harsher than if it were behind an umbrella so watch for that. If it happens, I'd reduce the output further.

[pcho]

Thanks Rudi, Kevin and Jeff,

I will try all the suggestions today if my kids would pose for me and not tell me to p......... otherwise I may have to get my wife instead. If all fails I stll have the dog :biglaugh::biglaugh:

Perry